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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 30 post(s) |
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
44
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Posted - 2013.08.29 19:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
Ammo bay please. |
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
44
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 20:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
I guess by now you are all trying to come up with a PVP use for a "stationary mode" ship which has lost the web bonus that could have gotten it kills through the siege mode ewar immunity. Something else than being obvious bait 2013.
1) MJD inside a hostile titan
2) siege inside titan before physics grid recognizes you
3) bump titan off grid
???
5) profit |
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
44
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 21:14:00 -
[3] - Quote
PVE:
GÇó Every one of them gains a big buff, especially Kronos and Paladin (neutron/megapulse). Golem becomes better at torpedoes with the range bonus.
GÇó They all will afk steamroll ded10/10 in t2 gank fits.
GÇó They can fit 3 smartbombs and sit in forsaken hub / gate haven spawn with improved close range weapons; beats vindicators due to smartbombing.
GÇó WH stuff, incursion stuff, shiny fits solo tank it all except for neuts. The numbers would put a 5k-10k active tank pretty standard with deadspace mods and crystals.
A damage bonus would be stupid overkill on these and obsolete everything else in pve.
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The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
48
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Posted - 2013.08.31 20:16:00 -
[4] - Quote
Paladin stands to gain the most out of this. It will obsolete everything for killing EM/THERM weak rats.
The reason is that the optimal buff makes conflagration builds viable. We are looking at 1218 plain gun dps without implants at 37+25 range sieged, 27+18 unsieged. This is well enough for missions when complemented with 1k@50+30 Gamma and 875@90k scorch. This also tanks easily with just t2 repper and damage control.
Any damage buff on these would just obsolete other PVE ships for many purposes. |
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
51
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Posted - 2013.09.01 16:39:00 -
[5] - Quote
The ships should be balanced by their topmost min-maxed PVE capability as far as PVE goes to make sure they don't obsolete each other or pirate BS.
DPS with current ranges:
Golem 1258dps Rage torpedo (26km) or 1070dps CN torpedo (30km)
Kronos 1504dps Void (10+13km), 1348dps CNAM (6+26km) or 1074dps Null (19+37km)
Paladin 1218dps Conflag (20+17km), 1040dps IN gamma (26+20km) or 877dps Scorch (62+20km)
Vargur 1177dps Hail (4+56km), 1054dps RF ammo (4+75km)
With the optimal buff Paladin with Conflagration will reach 27km base optimal.
With the siege mode buff all the ships will be very efficient at 30km-40km range and similiarly effective at 50km far orbit range. However, the Golem is lacking because of it's limited torpedo range and bad damage application with Rage torpedoes.
I would look into improving the Golem siege bonus to missile velocity AND travel time to make the Rage build more viable at PVE ranges. 25% to both missile velocity and fuel when sieged, based on the potential numbers on each of the ships.
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The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2013.09.06 07:49:00 -
[6] - Quote
BLINK MARAUDERS:
blink mode:
------------------------------------/
GÇó t2 resist
GÇó MJD blinky blinky
GÇó target spectrum breaker
------------------------------------/
Bonus:
Bastion and hybrid ancillary/buffer tank. |
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2013.09.06 08:59:00 -
[7] - Quote
The four utility high slots are too much. Three to four neutralizers for station games, four slot spider tank... Those alone with the t2 resists are worth the isk and sp requirements.
If bastion is introduced the resist bonus should go there. Otherwise dump the ewar immunity for something more geared towards the marauder roles of t2 resist. Or, get rid of the MJD bonus and make them slow bricks.
T2 = specialized
Now, marauder is "specialized for seven intense roles" I.e. Generalized:
GÇó brick t2 resist
GÇó good damage
GÇó MJD blink
GÇó EWAR immunity
GÇó 4 utility highs
GÇó salvaging on go
GÇó target painting (golem)
Pick 2-3 and work on it.
EWAR immunity and t2 resist
Good damage, MJD blink
Good damage and t2 resist
Those are enough to build three different t2 battleships. Do not throw it all in one generalized mess basket.
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The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2013.09.06 12:30:00 -
[8] - Quote
Faceroll marauders with target breaker could be ridiculously overpowered in fleet engagements.
With t2 resists 400k ehp could be standard while breaking all lock queues and target priorities on the fleet constantly. The damage application and target spectrum harass with the buffer looks untouchable to any other doctrine than sentry fleets as far as subcaps go. This all while being EWAR immune.
When enemy fleet is roflstomped and diminished, just unsiege and rep up with your RR chain. Alternately use dual ancillary tank to keep your buffer topped; with the target breaking, ehp and damage projection you'll stomp subcap fleets 10 to 1 kill ratio so who needs logistics.
To make matters worse you can do this while MJD kiting and sniping with superior projection.
The only counter seems to be dronefleets and caps. Oh right, you bring caps only when you have subcap dominance :)
POWER CREEP. |
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2013.09.06 13:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
Why this marauder idea is bad:
GÇó capitals are brought on field if subcap fight looks favorable
GÇó t2 buffer marauders roflstomp all other subcap fleets (possibly even worse with target spectrum breakers putting the EHP into good use)
GÇó only bang for buck counter is dronefleet
What could be done about it:
Make the bastion a siege mode with guns gaining double rate of fire but hopping tracking and resolution to dread levels. This would make marauders an anti-capital power creep mechanism. The bastion mode would only hit structures and capships, for subcaps you use them like normal BS. Cut the t2 resist crap and roll bonus into bastion which now won't work against subcaps. Cut the ewar immunity crap. Keep the damage projection bonus in hull stats to make them decent for pve. Cut the MJD crap. |
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
60
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Posted - 2013.09.06 13:54:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rroff wrote:The Spod wrote:Why this marauder idea is bad:
GÇó capitals are brought on field if subcap fight looks favorable
GÇó t2 buffer marauders roflstomp all other subcap fleets (possibly even worse with target spectrum breakers putting the EHP into good use)
GÇó only bang for buck counter is dronefleet
What could be done about it:
Make the bastion a siege mode with guns gaining double rate of fire but hopping tracking and resolution to dread levels. This would make marauders an anti-capital power creep mechanism. The bastion mode would only hit structures and capships, for subcaps you use them like normal BS. Cut the t2 resist crap and roll bonus into bastion which now won't work against subcaps. Cut the ewar immunity crap. Keep the damage projection bonus in hull stats to make them decent for pve. Cut the MJD crap. They'd still die ridiculously fast against dreads tho - from the logfile of taking down a POCO recently: 78142 - Penetrates 121413 - Smashes 70811 - Penetrates 97167 - Smashes 102970 - Smashes 73963 - Penetrates And thats a fairly typical example of any section of the log - even factoring in resists very little sub-capital thats sitting dead still will survive against that let alone against 2 or more dreads and that wasn't even a gank fit moros.
This is a good thing. The difference in range, lock timeand numbers still vastly favor the marauder blob. It's not supposed to solo kill a capital, that would just be redundant power creep.
It's the subcapital anti-capital wing.
Dropping dreads on 200 marauders each pushing 2000-3000dps against capitals, each sporting target spectrum breaker to make the dread pilots hate their lock time... Not a good move. |
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The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
62
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Posted - 2013.09.07 11:01:00 -
[11] - Quote
The use for webs in pve is going to be in nullsec anoms, incursions and whs. I still don't like the bonus, it has nothing to do with marauders other than to make them solo station games ships. Marauders should be fleet ships and specialized, not solo active tank pvp mobiles.
Just ditch the webs, they are arbitrary design. Less is more. |
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